Cheap starters

[Nerdlinger]

Anyone tried this: eBay item number: 371153011308 "STARTER MOTOR 0.95 KW VW TRANSPORTER BUS T3 1.9 2.1 YEARS 1986-1992" for £64.50 with no exchange surcharge and including delivery to my house on the north coast of Scotland...! I couldn't resist.

If it sounds too good to be true etcetera but I've been having trouble with full price starter motors so I might as well try a cheap one and I can DIY fix the old one for next time. Mine is a 1985 1.9 DG but a little research (mainly wiki here) indicates early and late are interchangeable.

The first starter failed intermittently before giving up after 6 years including a lot of travelling around Europe, probably over 50k miles plus however much it did before I bought the van. I got a replacement from a GSF shop which failed (didn't turn or click on bench) after 18 months of light use, probably only 5k miles but I did have some engine running problems which involved turning the starter over for too long to start it. I got the next one from Brickwerks including some large postage costs and that one lasted 2.5 years (starts if tapped with a hammer and turns on bench but nothing without tapping when in-situ even with jump leads directly connected to battery. Brushes?). Both fails have happened since moving here and I wonder if it might be the damp salty air (my poor van!) and the infrequent use, similar to the sticky brakes we get here.

[R0B]

I have read many times you should not test the starter off the vehicle.Apparently it kills them.Did you change the oilite bush each time you changed the starters?

[Nerdlinger]

Yes I have seen that advice about testing off the vehicle, because the end that is usually held by the bush can move about and cause damage. I wonder if this freer movement helps make contact with brushes and accounts for why it works each time I bench tested it (3 times, very briefly, not long enough to spin it, maybe I got away with it).

I did change the bush each time I fitted a fresh starter, using a tap to extract it (thanks to this site).

[CovKid]

Odd one. Worth noting that the vast majority of problematic starters merely need a damned good clean - particularly all the carbon dust from the brushes inside. Brushes are easy enough to change if you have a BIG soldering iron or gas-powered one but I'd expect them to last a lot longer than yours have. I now no longer buy starters from outlets partly because the cost is often ridiculous and because you can't always verify who actually rebuilt it. I note that ECP want over £400 for a bosch starter - what???

I rebuild/service my own starters myself and its very rare I encounter one that can't be rebuilt, and even then I'll keep parts for spares. Unfortunately the cost of v-dub starters seems to have reached the heady heights of every other starter in terms of cost. Good reason to learn how they work, their weak points and how to bring them back to life. Usually its a damaged or partly-detached braided cable, worn out solenoid, bad connections or main cables, loose trigger wire, or worn brushes. The bearings seem to be fairly long lasting but I'm not convinced all starter remanufacturers use good quality bearings. Windings could break down I suppose, particularly if they were not part of the rebuild, and I suspect they're not in most cases.

There a lot of good advice on rebuilding alternators and starters on youtube, with a vice being the main tool of choice.

[RogerT]

North coast? Whereabouts?

[Nerdlinger]

Smoo, other end of the North Coast from you.

[Nerdlinger]

the rusty brush is one of a pair which are insulated from the brush holder the other two are directly connected to it. I expect the rust has created enough of an electrical short circuit across the insulation to bugger things up. I probably also have a small coolant leak in this area... The ingress appears to have been through one of the two Philips screw holes on that rhomboid end-cap, if only it was more waterproof.

[Nerdlinger]

on closer inspection the rusty brush is seized and the opposite one is sticky so it might have been just that, it would fit the symptoms. I think it just needs cleaning as CovKid suggested. Any tips for cleaning rust off the brush holder assembly? Could I just soak it in something acidic like vinegar?

[CovKid]

Yeah, vinegar would do it

Then when its sorted, make sure the end cap has a little sealant on it to keep the water out. Should be fine after that

You could also put a thin coat of vactan on brush pack or even a quick spray with some paint afterwards to reduce further rusting.

[Oldiebut goodie]

Myself, I would strip it down completely and sand blast it - it will be difficult to clean the rust in the brush holders in many ways. If you aren't up for that I would just replace the brush holder and plate.

[Nerdlinger]

You're probably right, the rust looks glassy as if it has been cooked as well but I'll try vinegar before I order a brush holder. I might need a bush as well because I'm struggling to get it off the end of the shaft to remove the holder.

One other problem is I don't know what make or model it is. There are no legible markings and I can't see any likely candidates on the JCR site. Does anyone recognise this type of starter?

[Oldiebut goodie]

I can't help without marks and numbers - I have a lot of part numbers for Bosch starters and alternators.
That bush should come off easy enough with a puller - make sure that the jaws make as much contact as possible otherwise you risk breaking it as they are brittle.

[RogerT]

Smoo, other end of the North Coast from you.

That is a substantial distance away, especially on that road!

[Oldiebut goodie]

He's the only T25 in the village over there!

[Nerdlinger]

My shiny new starter motor came today, fitted, smothered in petroleum jelly, fired up OK. The late version is a bit more powerful and I think that is noticeable but maybe I'm projecting my expectation. There was no bush supplied with it, I have a spare but I couldn't be bothered fitting it, I'm not sure it's necessary and by now I am accustomed to replacing it if actually required.

It is marked "ATEC germany 10682524".

Time will tell if it is as good as the twice as expensive refurbs but it only has to go for longer than 2.5 years to beat GSF and Brickwerks. Watch this space, patiently...

My first impression is that it is good and why the F do the usual suspects charge so much for a refurb?