Fridge flame status indicator - a little electronics projec
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- mr_nunn
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Fridge flame status indicator - a little electronics projec
Hello,
I have had the fridge out to seal up the burner box and stop it going out all the time. It's the original electrolux 3 way fridge fitted in the Westy.
While it was out, I set myself a little mission this week to make a flame status indicator for gas burner. The original - a little green and white needle gauge - is defunct, and I had no luck with a Wanted ad. It is a total pain trying to work out whether the thing has lit/gone out etc. The part does seem to be available from the US or Australia - but for about £100 with postage... a bit excessive!
It was quite a fun task so I thought I would put a brief account/description here in case others would find it interesting/useful!
The first step was to investigate the signal going to the old broken gauge. This took two connections. One wire was earthed to the fridge body, the other came from the burner thermocouple via this wire:
A multimeter told me it was at about -12mV when the burner was on full, and about -5mV with the burner on low, relative to the body.
What to do with these tiny voltages?
After a bit of investigating I learned that an op-amp set up as an inverting amplifier would be a good choice to amplify this into a useable positive voltage for an LED. I then got a bit ambitious and decided to set up 2 op-amp circuits, with one set up to light an LED at the slightest voltage from the signal wire, and the other calibrated to light up a second LED only when the voltage reached about -10mV - so the indicator would distinguish between the low and high burn levels, as determined by the fridge thermostat.
A single 50p chip is availabile with 2 op amps on it, which i picked with some other (all v cheap components) at Maplins.
There is a brilliant Android app (probably also available on other platforms) called Every Circuit which allows you to easily draw and then simulate circuits to check ideas, and also to calibrate component values. Below a screenshot of the Every Circuit simulation of the final circuit i worked out (sorry the layout is a bit all over the place). The resistor values are set up such that one of the op-amps will "saturate" at the slightest input voltage. The second one is set up so that when the input voltage hits -10mV, there is just enough output to trigger the transistor to open and allow the second LED to light. This all took a bit of trial and error, but that's very easy with the app!
Next step was a "prototype" on an easy "push to connect" breadboard.. a bit more tweaking of resistor values was then needed, as on the first go the red led was on even with no flame and the green was on even at low flame. (It was actually at this point i worked out that i needed to add the transistor to get a clean switch-on point at the higher input voltage for the green led).
Then once working..planned a layout on a project board and soldering everything in place. All a bit fiddly as I am not very practiced with soldering.
This is the end result...
And tidied up a bit:
...and it seems to work really nicely! The red led lights straight up as soon as the fridge lights, and the green one comes on a few seconds later as it hits full heat... the green one goes out as intended when the thermostat drops the burner down to low. Hurrah - no more desperately trying to squint to see through the hopeless burner peep hole, or listening with tubing through the condensation drain tube to hear if the burner is lit!
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I have had the fridge out to seal up the burner box and stop it going out all the time. It's the original electrolux 3 way fridge fitted in the Westy.
While it was out, I set myself a little mission this week to make a flame status indicator for gas burner. The original - a little green and white needle gauge - is defunct, and I had no luck with a Wanted ad. It is a total pain trying to work out whether the thing has lit/gone out etc. The part does seem to be available from the US or Australia - but for about £100 with postage... a bit excessive!
It was quite a fun task so I thought I would put a brief account/description here in case others would find it interesting/useful!
The first step was to investigate the signal going to the old broken gauge. This took two connections. One wire was earthed to the fridge body, the other came from the burner thermocouple via this wire:
A multimeter told me it was at about -12mV when the burner was on full, and about -5mV with the burner on low, relative to the body.
What to do with these tiny voltages?
After a bit of investigating I learned that an op-amp set up as an inverting amplifier would be a good choice to amplify this into a useable positive voltage for an LED. I then got a bit ambitious and decided to set up 2 op-amp circuits, with one set up to light an LED at the slightest voltage from the signal wire, and the other calibrated to light up a second LED only when the voltage reached about -10mV - so the indicator would distinguish between the low and high burn levels, as determined by the fridge thermostat.
A single 50p chip is availabile with 2 op amps on it, which i picked with some other (all v cheap components) at Maplins.
There is a brilliant Android app (probably also available on other platforms) called Every Circuit which allows you to easily draw and then simulate circuits to check ideas, and also to calibrate component values. Below a screenshot of the Every Circuit simulation of the final circuit i worked out (sorry the layout is a bit all over the place). The resistor values are set up such that one of the op-amps will "saturate" at the slightest input voltage. The second one is set up so that when the input voltage hits -10mV, there is just enough output to trigger the transistor to open and allow the second LED to light. This all took a bit of trial and error, but that's very easy with the app!
Next step was a "prototype" on an easy "push to connect" breadboard.. a bit more tweaking of resistor values was then needed, as on the first go the red led was on even with no flame and the green was on even at low flame. (It was actually at this point i worked out that i needed to add the transistor to get a clean switch-on point at the higher input voltage for the green led).
Then once working..planned a layout on a project board and soldering everything in place. All a bit fiddly as I am not very practiced with soldering.
This is the end result...
And tidied up a bit:
...and it seems to work really nicely! The red led lights straight up as soon as the fridge lights, and the green one comes on a few seconds later as it hits full heat... the green one goes out as intended when the thermostat drops the burner down to low. Hurrah - no more desperately trying to squint to see through the hopeless burner peep hole, or listening with tubing through the condensation drain tube to hear if the burner is lit!
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Re: Fridge flame status indicator - a little electronics projec
That's brilliant, and thanks for pointing to the circuit app.
I'd have a go at all sorts of simple electronic things but I'm short on knowledge to make them. Perhaps that app is the answer.
I'd have a go at all sorts of simple electronic things but I'm short on knowledge to make them. Perhaps that app is the answer.
1.9D (AEF) pop-top. Aaaaahhhhh........that's better.
- mr_nunn
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Re: Fridge flame status indicator - a little electronics projec
Thanks!
@colinthefox: The app is a great learning tool - if I remember rightly it also has some tutorial/example circuits with explanations of how they work. I can also recommend a book called Make: Electronics by Charles Platt for the basics. Oh and the internet! I am no electronics expert but always been keen to learn more. So satisfying when you get something to actually work!
@colinthefox: The app is a great learning tool - if I remember rightly it also has some tutorial/example circuits with explanations of how they work. I can also recommend a book called Make: Electronics by Charles Platt for the basics. Oh and the internet! I am no electronics expert but always been keen to learn more. So satisfying when you get something to actually work!
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- badgerfax
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Re: Fridge flame status indicator - a little electronics projec
Love stuff like this
Twist my nipple nuts and send me to Alaska.
Re: Fridge flame status indicator - a little electronics projec
Nice work! My indicator lamp never worked and I recently swapped out the LED control board from Go Westy. That solved the problem but I also upgraded my igniter to an electronic one that allows you to add an LED to show that the igniter is firing and stays lit once the flame is going. Not my mod but a fellow named Otmar, very easy and the leg work is done.
Here is a link to his photos of his work. http://cafeelectric.com/public/vw/fridgemods/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Here is a link to his photos of his work. http://cafeelectric.com/public/vw/fridgemods/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
1987 Westy
What the Westy Wants,The Westy Gets
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What the Westy Wants,The Westy Gets
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Re: Fridge flame status indicator - a little electronics projec
Assuming it runs off 12v, would a cheap electronic temperature display and probe not be easier? It would only need the probe slightly near the flame to get a useful reading. Not as fun I agree, but would serve similar purpose.
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- mr_nunn
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Re: Fridge flame status indicator - a little electronics projec
Imagine that could be made to work too.. though possibly somewhat of a hassle to get the probe placed inside the burner box in the right position and reseal the burner box.CovKid wrote:Assuming it runs off 12v, would a cheap electronic temperature display and probe not be easier? It would only need the probe slightly near the flame to get a useful reading. Not as fun I agree, but would serve similar purpose.
My version doubled as a good excuse to have a play and learn a bit more about electronics so I was happy to start from scratch.
A further refinement i am thinking about next time I have the fridge out is to add another led somewhere on the panel above (so visible with the door closed) that would be off when the flame is burning and flashing if flame went out..so basically an "it's gone out" warning lamp. The signal would just need to be inverted and i guess a cheap 555 timer chip could get it flashing. At the moment i have to peek inside the door periodically to check my indicator leds.
That said sealing up the burner box (i replaced the gasket and also spread some exhaust repair paste over the join) seems to have got rid of my problem of the flame blowing out all the time so it's not as much of an issue as before.
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- mr_nunn
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Re: Fridge flame status indicator - a little electronics projec
Electronic igniter would be a good upgrade as it could then be set up to refire automatically if the flame blew out (which I think the later models did anyway).Timwhy wrote:Nice work! My indicator lamp never worked and I recently swapped out the LED control board from Go Westy. That solved the problem but I also upgraded my igniter to an electronic one that allows you to add an LED to show that the igniter is firing and stays lit once the flame is going. Not my mod but a fellow named Otmar, very easy and the leg work is done.
Here is a link to his photos of his work. http://cafeelectric.com/public/vw/fridgemods/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Fridge flame status indicator - a little electronics projec
mr_nunn wrote: Electronic igniter would be a good upgrade as it could then be set up to refire automatically if the flame blew out (which I think the later models did anyway).
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Exactly! Here's a link to my fridge firing up using the blue LED switch to show when it's lit.
https://www.facebook.com/tim.whynot.5/v ... 415792521/
Link to the igniter I purchased.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00BT ... UTF8&psc=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
1987 Westy
What the Westy Wants,The Westy Gets
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_ ... ts=summary" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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What the Westy Wants,The Westy Gets
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_ ... ts=summary" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.youtube.com/user/TIMWHY2?feature=mhee" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: Fridge flame status indicator - a little electronics projec
Timwhy wrote: Link to the igniter I purchased.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00BT ... UTF8&psc=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Thanks for the links Timwhy... one question - in upgrading to the electronic ignition module, can the original cable and the actual sparking end inside the burner box be retained? I am just wondering if this upgrade can be done without taking apart the burner box (which I have just painstakingly resealed to finally stop the fridge going out all the time!)
So can you connect the electronic module above to the original cable? Or does it need its own cable and sparker placing inside the burner?
Thanks!
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Re: Fridge flame status indicator - a little electronics projec
mr_nunn wrote:Timwhy wrote: Link to the igniter I purchased.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00BT ... UTF8&psc=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Thanks for the links Timwhy... one question - in upgrading to the electronic ignition module, can the original cable and the actual sparking end inside the burner box be retained? I am just wondering if this upgrade can be done without taking apart the burner box (which I have just painstakingly resealed to finally stop the fridge going out all the time!)
So can you connect the electronic module above to the original cable? Or does it need its own cable and sparker placing inside the burner?
Thanks!
Same cable, just disconnected from the sparker and altered a little bit to fit in the the electric unit. I'll get the samba thread posted up this morning with all the directions.
1987 Westy
What the Westy Wants,The Westy Gets
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_ ... ts=summary" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.youtube.com/user/TIMWHY2?feature=mhee" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
What the Westy Wants,The Westy Gets
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_ ... ts=summary" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.youtube.com/user/TIMWHY2?feature=mhee" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
- mr_nunn
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Re: Fridge flame status indicator - a little electronics projec
Timwhy wrote:mr_nunn wrote:Timwhy wrote: Link to the igniter I purchased.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00BT ... UTF8&psc=1" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Thanks for the links Timwhy... one question - in upgrading to the electronic ignition module, can the original cable and the actual sparking end inside the burner box be retained? I am just wondering if this upgrade can be done without taking apart the burner box (which I have just painstakingly resealed to finally stop the fridge going out all the time!)
So can you connect the electronic module above to the original cable? Or does it need its own cable and sparker placing inside the burner?
Thanks!
Same cable, just disconnected from the sparker and altered a little bit to fit in the the electric unit. I'll get the samba thread posted up this morning with all the directions.
Thanks Timwhy that's really good to know - if there is a Samba thread with details on this I'd be really interested to read it.
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Re: Fridge flame status indicator - a little electronics projec
1987 Westy
What the Westy Wants,The Westy Gets
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_ ... ts=summary" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.youtube.com/user/TIMWHY2?feature=mhee" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
What the Westy Wants,The Westy Gets
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_ ... ts=summary" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
http://www.youtube.com/user/TIMWHY2?feature=mhee" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
- mr_nunn
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Re: Fridge flame status indicator - a little electronics projec
Awesome many thanks!
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