SA big brakes help

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Re: SA big brakes help

Postby clift_d » 23 Jul 2018, 14:45

It seems like the issue will be with fitting SA brakes on a non-SA van. It may be that the SA hardline is always behind the axle whether 2WD or Syncro in which case I'm guessing the Busschmeide hoses are probably sized to match an OEM setup like that.

If I need to look at a banjo fitting do I need M10x1 or M10x1.25?
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Re: SA big brakes help

Postby 937carrera » 23 Jul 2018, 16:05

Unless they are different to the standard caliper fittings m10 x 1....... but why go for banjo style when you can use standard design (at least with Goodridge)?

https://www.brickwerks.co.uk/hardware/fluid-handling/brake-lines.html
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Re: SA big brakes help

Postby clift_d » 23 Jul 2018, 16:44

The location of the inlet on the SA calipers is on the top face at right angles to the run of the brake hose, and so lends itself to some kind of right angle connector such as a banjo connector, rather than some type of inline connector.

Image
Existing setup

Image
SA caliper offered up
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Re: SA big brakes help

Postby 4x4 Bus » 24 Jul 2018, 19:47

Standard SA 2WD hose works perfectly. You do need to lengthen or replace your brake pipes to extend to the rear of the spring seat. There is already a hole in the chassi for the bracket to fit.
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Re: SA big brakes help

Postby silverbullet » 24 Jul 2018, 20:27

So whatever you do, you will have to make up some brake pipes to make it all work. Its Sykes Pickavant flaring tool time.

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Re: SA big brakes help

Postby clift_d » 24 Jul 2018, 22:10

Presumably it's possible in the interim to run a custom banjo fitting flex hose until the hard line pipes can be moved? The length should be fairly easy to determine from the current setup.

Also, would it really be necessary to fit a spring 'shield' as appears to be present in Ian's first picture?
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Re: SA big brakes help

Postby silverbullet » 25 Jul 2018, 09:51

Its not a spring sheild, its part of the chassis/spring turret

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Re: SA big brakes help

Postby clift_d » 04 Aug 2018, 12:03

I'm having a go with Goodridge stainless braided hose and fittings as this allows me to size to length by offering up to the existing setup.

Image
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SA big brakes help

Postby clift_d » 04 Aug 2018, 20:14

Okay I've got the first side fitted. I used a Goodridge flex brake hose to connect the hard line in front of the wheel to the caliper. This hose basically follows the route of the standard 2WD / Syncro brake hose, but with a banjo fitting to the caliper in place of the short hard line in the OEM setup. Long term the setup will probably evolve to the standard SA OEM routing with the hard line moved to behind the wheel and a shorter flex hose.

The length of the flex hose i ended up with is 600mm from end of female fitting to centre of the banjo.

A couple of pictures- the retaining spring wasn't fitted for the first image.

Image

Image

I only managed to get the first side fitted and bled today - I'll tackle the other side tomorrow, and then take the van for a run to bed them in.

A couple of gotchas that slowed me down:

- the centre hole in the SA brake disc needs to be filed out slightly in order to fit over the centre of the hub. I was fitting a new disc from BW so I'm guessing the SA hubs are maybe a slightly different size to the Steyr Syncro ones

- a 3mm spacer is needed with the 16" OEM steel Syncro wheels otherwise they seem foul on the edge of the caliper.
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SA big brakes help

Postby clift_d » 28 Aug 2018, 10:48

Just for the record the following are the parts codes for SA front vented brakes:

996 615 123 - Left caliper (1No. required)
996 615 124 - Right caliper (1No. required)
996 615 125 - Brake carriers (1No. per caliper)
996 615 270 - Retaining springs (1No. per caliper)
22S 698 151 B - Brake pads (1No. set required)
22S 615 301 - Brake disc (2No. required)
113 615 273 A - Bleed nipple M10x1.0 (1No. per caliper)
211 611 483 - Bleed nipple dust cap (1No. per caliper)
22S 611 775 B - Flexible brake hose (1No. per caliper)
996 698 002 - Repair kit (1No. per caliper)

You also need a pair of M16x3.0 washers between the brake carrier and steering upright to properly centre the carrier to the brake disc.

Most parts are now NLA, although the repair kits are still available through VW Classic in Germany, brake pads and discs can be sourced from Brickwerks, and Busschmeide does replacement flexi-hose sets.
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Re: SA big brakes help

Postby Aidan » 28 Aug 2018, 16:50

And do you think the van stops that much better now ?
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Re: SA big brakes help

Postby clift_d » 28 Aug 2018, 17:28

The brakes feel a bit more modern in the way they respond, if that makes sense, particularly if braking quickly for whatever reason. The main reason for changing them over though was to prevent the overheating / brake fade issues we've experienced previously, and they seemed to do this did very well this summer in the picos de europa.
:ok
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Re: SA big brakes help

Postby 937carrera » 28 Aug 2018, 17:52

clift_d wrote:The brakes feel a bit more modern in the way they respond, if that makes sense, particularly if braking quickly for whatever reason. The main reason for changing them over though was to prevent the overheating / brake fade issues we've experienced previously, and they seemed to do this did very well this summer in the picos de europa.
:ok


You can thank the Goodridge hoses for some of that they really do make a difference to pedal feel and initial bite. If the fade was from fluid boiling then a change of fluid (higher boiling point, not just fresh DOT 4) can also solve that.
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Re: SA big brakes help

Postby clift_d » 28 Aug 2018, 18:43

937carrera wrote:If the fade was from fluid boiling then a change of fluid (higher boiling point, not just fresh DOT 4) can also solve that.


Understood, but it was basically down to the brake discs / pads overheating - the smell was chronic.
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