Am I Being Naive?

Big lumps of metals and spanners. Including servicing and fluids.

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Snowmark
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Am I Being Naive?

Post by Snowmark »

Reading this forum has given me the confidence to attempt stuff on the van that I had absolutely no idea about a year ago.

So, I want to fit a new SS exhaust - is it stupid of me to think that I can do this? I have unlimited access to a ramp but have no mechanical knowledge or any idea of what to do with the inevitable seized nuts/broken studs. If I have a go then make a complete hash of it who do I call to get me back on the road?

Should I just pay someone? .......It is only 8 nuts......Any advice gratefully received.
Many thanks.
1.9DG (It does look like one sad has already been drilled out as there is a bolt in one position)
1986 1.9DG WBX Autosleeper Hi Top

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pierce
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Re: Am I Being Naive?

Post by pierce »

The first time I took the exhaust off the van it took hours, blowtorch, nut splitter, hammer etc.
After 4 years it came off again, two snapped studs at the turbo but nothing major.

It all depends how long it's been on, if the nuts are recognisable as nuts then you probably have a good chance.

Just crack them open one by one and if they all come loose, you are good to go :ok
88 Westie 1.6TD

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Snowmark
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Re: Am I Being Naive?

Post by Snowmark »

Thanks Pierce - what do I need to invest in tool wise? evidently a 'nut splitter' (rushes off to google to find out what one looks like).
I guess you have to change the studs - how the hell do you get the old ones out?
1986 1.9DG WBX Autosleeper Hi Top

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pierce
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Re: Am I Being Naive?

Post by pierce »

You hopefully won't need a nut splitter :D

You may get away with a couple of spanners, although a socket set will make things easier and is a good investment, having some sockets with hex heads (the exact shape of the nut) stops you rounding a worn nut as easily.

If you squirt the nuts with wd40 or making them red hot with a blow torch, helps break any bond the nut had with the bolt, you may not need this though if they have been changed in the last few years.

Don't worry about the studs they are just bolts without heads, you get them out by creating a head by making a lock but, which is just 2 nuts tightened against each other. Sometimes they come out on their own especially if the nut is stuck to the stud.

It's a great idea to learn about fixing your van, it's a great place to start. One job at a time and you will soon be confident. You can get help on here, there are some real experts knocking about.
88 Westie 1.6TD

Highroller
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Re: Am I Being Naive?

Post by Highroller »

If you have unlimited access to a ramp and in no desperate hurry to change the exhaust then I would start off with some plusgas and a couple of spanners, see what nuts / studs come out easily without forcing anything and take it from there before investing in expensive and unnecessary tools.
1991 2.1 WBX Devon microbus twinslider hightop

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Snowmark
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Re: Am I Being Naive?

Post by Snowmark »

Yep - think I'll stick it on the ramp once summer is over, treat it to a dose of Plusgas every day for a week then see what comes off.
Just need to get my head round removing the studs - will practice with 2 nuts. I assume you do them both up right then wind back the inner one, correct?
Thanks for all the advice
1986 1.9DG WBX Autosleeper Hi Top

Highroller
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Re: Am I Being Naive?

Post by Highroller »

Worry about getting the nuts off first. If the studs look as if they are in good condition then I would probably leave them alone. Use brass nuts and copper washers when refitting as this will help in the future if you have to remove the exhaust.
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Mr Bean
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Re: Am I Being Naive?

Post by Mr Bean »

I agree. My advice would be not to go anywhere near the exhaust/cylinder fixings until you are prepared for one or more to strip, break off or otherwise render you van undrive-able. Once you start you may get sucked into jobs which involve cylinder head removal etc. My engine re-builder used set screws and at least one is stripped so I am leaving well alone until after the holidays are done. Studs and nuts are definitely the order of the day. Some of the threads stop just short of the coolant channels.
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Re: Am I Being Naive?

Post by Sir Brixalot »

You'd only be saving a bit of labour, is it worth it? I do as much as possible myself but got a garage to fit SS exhaust. Partly because the muffler would need welding to the hanger and also working under the van on domestic ramps doesn't give that much room for a breaker bar
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Moonrakers
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Re: Am I Being Naive?

Post by Moonrakers »

Nope, don't do it yourself if the exhaust hasn't been changed in the last few years (or if the nuts are obviously corroded and deformed) - a world of pain awaits. You could easily snap a stud in the head before you knew it by wrenching away with a can of plus-gas and a prayer and once that happens all bets are off.

It's great fun maintaining a T25 and learning about basic servicing and more advanced maintenance, but messing about with broken studs is above and beyond. If you get a decent mechanic to use an oxy torch to heat the nuts cherry-red and attack them with his top-quality tools and some experience, he might save you a lot of money and grief..
Current VW: 1986 Devon Moonraker, pop-top, 1.9 DG, 5-Speed

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Re: Am I Being Naive?

Post by kevtherev »

If I stopped trying to do my own maintenance everytime there was a "risk" I would never get anywhere.
Take advice and research yourself.
Then do it.
I used an angle grinder with a cutting disc to gain good access to the nuts.
Your research will bring up removal of rusty nuts on studs.
In many cases it will involve red heat on the nut and a hex socket.
If you cant heat them up till they glow then use gallons of penetrating fluid.
Replace all nuts with stainless and use stainless bolts if you can.
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Snowmark
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Re: Am I Being Naive?

Post by Snowmark »

Thanks Everyone- food for thought.....
I have access to a full-on hydraulic ramp so can work standing up. I've done more investigation over the last 2 days whilst changing the water pump - the nuts are rusted but still have 'shape'. Was thinking about cutting the pipes back, as suggested, so that I can attack the nuts without pain and swearing.

Obviously the list has grown as it would seem the ideal time to replace push rod tubes/covers......better get to work and earn some money.
Thanks again
1986 1.9DG WBX Autosleeper Hi Top

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ajsimmo
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Re: Am I Being Naive?

Post by ajsimmo »

Careful now.
We charge £750 fitted for the VWSpeedshop system. We do a fixed price because it helps people budget. We can do it because we fit so many, we can average out the easy and the hard ones. Some only take a couple of hours, a couple have been an engine out job, drilling out fixings that have either snapped, or are so corroded there's nothing left to get hold of. If threads are knackered, we drill and tap out to M10 and fit step down studs to make them all standard M8 studs, then use anti-seize nuts (either stainless or copper coated). Sometimes special 12mm AF M8 exhaust nuts can be a good idea, as it's easier to get a spanner/socket onto it, and much less likely to over-tighten and damage threads. Use good quality gaskets (available from Brickwerks)!
So approach cautiously, take your time, use a shock/release freezing spray, Plusgas, and lots of heat in rotation. Try not to snap head studs, but snapping anything else downstream won't matter, it'll help.
Good luck!!


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AngeloEvs
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Re: Am I Being Naive?

Post by AngeloEvs »

I took mine in as I felt this would be better done with the van on hydraulic ramps but being my local village garage I was able to work with John who owned the garage. My exhaust had been on from new and the nuts were in poor condition.

He cut the exhaust away leaving just the flanges that were much easier to access. A combination of heat, splitters, those sockets hat grip rounded nuts, angle grinder, etc and lots of patience and it was job done. Patience was key, some proved stubborn and I was worried about it becoming an 'engine out' job but John would try various methods.

Access to hydraulic ramps is a big bonus, I would not want to tackle this lying on my back.
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Re: Am I Being Naive?

Post by what2do »

If this job goes the way that so many do then there's one thing you will need but aren't able to buy - experience. If you're prepared for the worse and relish the challenges that this brings then crack on. In my opinion, someone with limited experience would be better to save themselves the trouble and pay someone else to do it. Skills are developed over a period of time, beginners often encounter a seized nut/bolt and just apply more force to continue undoing it, resulting in many curses and sheared bolts. Experience teaches you other methods.

It's your call...
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