Rebuild Thread (Probably)

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Re: Rebuild Thread (Probably)

Postby Ciaraneng » 22 Oct 2018, 20:30

Thanks Paul/Carrera for the advice.

All bearings seem to be available through BW or VWHeritage but sadly stretch bolts seem to be a thing of the past.

Spent a few hours yesterday and today undoing studs and bolts and I'm pretty sure I have all of them out. I just spent another hour first tapping and finally hammering with hardwood (to prevent dings) trying to split the case to no avail. I gave up and came inside when I accidentally dinged the head seal area on the case. :cry:

Do you guys have any advice or techniques for how to split the case? Whoever last split it sealed it with something pretty hard (photos taken before undoing nuts & bolts).

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Re: Rebuild Thread (Probably)

Postby 937carrera » 22 Oct 2018, 21:06

:shock: :roll: :shock:

Not quite understanding "a thin layer" were they. I anticipate it being as bad on the inside

You have the right method, well, that's to say the same method that I used, I had my bits of wood cut into a wedge shape, using a wooden or rubber mallet.

Nuts on the end of the case studs can also be used to apply some shock force

I would remove the excess sealant from the outside of the case as well, less adhesion to overcome
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Re: Rebuild Thread (Probably)

Postby Ciaraneng » 23 Oct 2018, 06:03

Thanks Carrera. Will try again this evening after work.
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Re: Rebuild Thread (Probably)

Postby itchyfeet » 23 Oct 2018, 06:37

my guess is you missed a bolt, I can see one n the picture above but maybe that was taken earlier.
there is a place to lever one side against the other where you don't damage any seal surface, its at the front lifting eye ( pulley end)

you can see in this pic where all the studs are and there are a few loose M8 bolts too.

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Re: Rebuild Thread (Probably)

Postby Ciaraneng » 23 Oct 2018, 09:40

Thanks Paul. I'm pretty sure I got them all but I'll double-check against your photo and have another go.
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Re: Rebuild Thread (Probably)

Postby itchyfeet » 23 Oct 2018, 11:49

Ciaraneng wrote:Thanks Paul. I'm pretty sure I got them all but I'll double-check against your photo and have another go.


possible somebody used the wrong sealant and it's well stuck I had one once that took a but of levering but usually not.

Another possibility is one of the main M10 studs have unscrewed and cut into the other half of the case before the cap head nut released, I have seen this if so one stud will be longer.
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Re: Rebuild Thread (Probably)

Postby Ciaraneng » 23 Oct 2018, 21:38

Doh! Had left two dome nuts in the jacket on. :oops:

Had no problems splitting the case once they were off. Thanks Paul for posting the photo. Made all the difference. Should have guessed the crank would be supported by more studs than I had undone.

Ah well. At least I’m in now. :)

Will post photos tomorrow but already seeing a few more problems....
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Re: Rebuild Thread (Probably)

Postby Ciaraneng » 24 Oct 2018, 21:37

Here are some photos of what I found inside the case. As you can probably tell, the camshaft is a worry.
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Also a worry is the fact that the crank appears to have no endfloat shims, no thrust washer and the retainer ring was sitting between the seal and the flywheel. I had a fairly constant drip from the bell housing and it's easy to see why. :roll:

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This is what my tappets look like. Are these solids?

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Right now I'm debating whether it's worth spending the money on 2 new heads, oil and coolant pumps, bearings, seals, rings, gaskets, and goodness knows what else or should I try to find a reconditioned engine. Still early days I guess but with the cam wear I'm seeing, there must be serious miles done and more costs to uncover once I start measuring in earnest. :roll:

Here are some other photos.All thoughts/opinions/advice on next steps welcome and much appreciated. :ok

Image
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Re: Rebuild Thread (Probably)

Postby 937carrera » 25 Oct 2018, 16:41

I just looked at my camshaft, I was a bit concerned about mine, but after looking at yours I'm not worried about mine at all. :cry: Sorry.

Paul's replaced a cam on his with a reground Aircooled one. I'm not keen on Aircooled bits being used for WBX as there'll be none left by the time I realise I need one, but it's an option for you. Do a search for Newman cams.

Can you confirm number 1 main is a one piece bearing - if so there's no thrust washer, but there should have been 3 shims. Have one of these :shock:

Those tappets don't look like my hydraulics, so I agree they're solids... which I think may also explain the camshaft wear

Bet you're glad you split it now.

So, is this a rebuild or not. If you do the rebuild you will do what you want to / need to. But a s/h engine, and it's unlikely you kow the history of what's inside, especially if the engine has been into one of the remanufacturers.

I think you need to continue the stripping / measuring process, before you can make a decision on rebuilding. You've nearly caugfht up to me on my "Unknown" engine, which has thrown up a couple of interesting bits.
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Re: Rebuild Thread (Probably)

Postby itchyfeet » 25 Oct 2018, 17:10

there is a engine going free in Herts, arrange a pallet courier for 60 quid and I bet it will yield lots of parts.

E D I T just seen you are in Ireland so maybe a courier is more but my point is second hand engines that are broken are a cheap source of parts.

that cam is something special
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Re: Rebuild Thread (Probably)

Postby Ciaraneng » 25 Oct 2018, 20:26

937carrera wrote:I just looked at my camshaft, I was a bit concerned about mine, but after looking at yours I'm not worried about mine at all.

:rofl
Glad to be of service Carrera. :ok
937carrera wrote:xaul's replaced a cam on his with a reground Aircooled one. I'm not keen on Aircooled bits being used for WBX as there'll be none left by the time I realise I need one, but it's an option for you. Do a search for Newman cams.

Is this camshaft not an option? Or this one
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Re: Rebuild Thread (Probably)

Postby Ciaraneng » 25 Oct 2018, 20:41

itchyfeet wrote:there is a engine going free in Herts, arrange a pallet courier for 60 quid and I bet it will yield lots of parts.

E D I T just seen you are in Ireland so maybe a courier is more but my point is second hand engines that are broken are a cheap source of parts.


Thanks for the really generous offer Paul. Let me look into shipping to Ireland over the weekend.

itchyfeet wrote:that cam is something special
I know right? If you're really keen on it I'll let you have it. :rofl
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Re: Rebuild Thread (Probably)

Postby 937carrera » 25 Oct 2018, 21:57

Ciaraneng wrote:Is this camshaft not an option?


Honest answer, I don't know, Paul or others probably will, but as this is a 3 bolt cam, (WBX are "4 bolt") so the ancillaries are probably also not WBX items. I suggest you read around to see if TES are one of the good rebuilders and what feedback others have.

Ciaraneng wrote:Or this one


Looks like OE are still available then, BUT

There's an additional size dimension on the gear when looking at WBX cams, more info here http://forum.club8090.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=156409&start=0
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Re: Rebuild Thread (Probably)

Postby Ciaraneng » 28 Oct 2018, 19:49

My camshaft has a -4 gear size and there is currently a backlash of .13mm between the gears. Does anyone know what size cam gear I should be trying to source?

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While I had the gauges out I measured the wear on the oil pump. I assume a .28mm backlash is too much regardless of end drift. Either way I'm tempted to change the oil pump.

Image

Whilst cleaning the pistons I noticed that the previous re-builder had used a pick-and-mix approach to ring selection. :shock:

Image
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Re: Rebuild Thread (Probably)

Postby Ciaraneng » 28 Oct 2018, 19:50

itchyfeet wrote:there is a engine going free in Herts, arrange a pallet courier for 60 quid and I bet it will yield lots of parts.

E D I T just seen you are in Ireland so maybe a courier is more but my point is second hand engines that are broken are a cheap source of parts.

Just sent you a PM on this Paul.
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